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U.S. Cavalry On Point Forums   » OnPoint   » Do you feel that U.S. First Responders will become the target of terrorists?   » first responders as targets  

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first responders as targets
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Posted 7/15/2005 12:17 PM
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Yes the easiest way to cause terror is to hurt those that help fight it. Look at the world trade centers 343 firefighters lost there lives trying to rescue people in the towers. That has had a major impact on ny city and the first responder services there. The chaos that comes from that is the goal of terrorists.

I guess my question would be what makes you think first responders aren't terrorist targets?
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Posted 7/15/2005 1:03 PM
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I don't think the first responders themselves will be the targets but the very nature of their work will does make them vulnerable to attack.  At the Twin Towers the Police and Firefighters lost were not lost because the terrorists wanted to kill them but because the were doing their duty and trying to save the victims of the attack.
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Posted 7/15/2005 1:15 PM
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There is little question they will be targets. In fact, we have been training to be alert for secondary devices that are specicically targeted at the first responder community following the initial device.

Now what we need to work on is the rush in and help mind-set. Unfortunately, that could result in the deaths of those who might be saved by quick action, but will result in fewer casulties.David A. Lane, KG4GIY
EC/RO Prince William Coun
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Posted 7/15/2005 1:21 PM
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In war, emergency services are targeted with the intent to demoralize . Since terrorism is not war, I doubt they will seek that objective.

As was just mentioned, I also think they will become victims after the fact, by not preparing for the possibility of NBC and IED attacks (was not meant to be a plug for the company...hehe). 

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Posted 7/15/2005 1:37 PM
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I think it is possible, but I would expect terrorists to go for targets like Hospitals, Malls etc. Disrupting normal life would appeal to them. Making free people fear Malls, transportation, and even the sfe haven of the Hospital could cause some serious physical and mental damage. But, insane individuals are sometime impossible to predict.that is why we all need to be aware of everything around us. the days of our carefree lifestyle is soon to be a fond memory.
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Posted 7/15/2005 2:58 PM


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Definately, because of the multi-faceted nature of this conflict. Some tango, somewhere, will go, "You know, lets kill some cops today." And another one will go, "Why?" And the first one will go, "Because it'll make the papers."

I looked at the 9/11 attacks, and when the second plane hit the second tower, I initially thought, "That's wonderful. They waited long enough for EMS to arrive and get tied up, then brought the other building down on their heads." Ie: They diliberately attacked again, to destroy or hinder the effectiveness of NYFD and NYPD. With the insanity that was going on, and the reduction of manpower, another attack somewhere else in NYC would of been even more effective. As it turned out, these were highly devistating symbolic attacks on their own right, and no further targets in NYC were selected that day.

I could see people targeting EMS services, say, the county ambulance headquarters, a hospital, the local fire department. After they're all tied up dealing with the damage caused to the infrastructure, a chem/bio weapon could be deployed at a shopping mall, stadium, or downtown Anyville, USA during lunch hour, when everybody's out and about walking to the local deli. They'll hear about the ambulance HQ being hit, and go, "That's too bad." The hospital may give them pause, but ya gotta eat.

In such, hitting targets before a planned strike to hinder response sounds like a good tactic, and something I somewhat expect in the future.

In another vein, release a suspect chemical agent in a shopping mall (OC would be effective), etc, and when the police and fire department show up, blow the place up. Your targeting the population center, and the responding EMS force and responding police.

If your in the homeland security, law enforcement, or private security professions, I suggest you sit down with your fellow officers, get some maps or use Google Earth, and plan out how to successfully attack and destroy your own area of operation/jurisdiction/client(s). First, do it using public knowledge, ie: the internet. Then, do it using your personal knowledge, including tactics, doctrine, and emergency response plans.

When you have the attack plan made up, gut it, and figure out ways to defeat it at each step. Then do it again, with another scenerio. I'm sure there are people in your organization who have a novel way of crippling it.



N. A. Corbier
Regional Vice-President
NAPSOA Protective Services Group


Advisor, State of Wisconsin
North American Professional Security Officer's Association


Member
Wisconsin Private Security and Police Association
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Posted 7/15/2005 6:03 PM
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I do think that when it happens that all EMS personel  wether the totally certified and or the the 1st Responders will find themselves to be at risk.  But USA will prevail and the go forward will overcome the threat.

Maltese
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Posted 7/18/2005 2:50 AM
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As a Paramedic and a member of joint Hazmat/CBRN response team, I feel that all emergency services are at risk. We respond to calls with information given to us by our dispatchers, who are inturn going off informatin given to them by some mysterious caller.  With the proliferation of cell phones and some areas lacking the ability to track calls it makes it harder to pin point the souce of the call and therefore easier for terrorists or other not so nice people to make easy targets of responders.  Most of us who work EMS where I do, we are not part of Fire Services or Police Services and rely on proper tiering for back up.  We do not have body armour issued, no weapons to protect ourselves or any self defense training.  If we have vsets or self defense trainig it has been paid for on our own. 

It is easy for terrorists or others to learn coverage patters or patrol patterns of emergency services as well as time out maximim response territory for EMS or Fire Services and stage fake calls to pull assets away from key targets or pull assets out to ambush them while attacking key targets. 

Tom

Paramedic

Canada

Tom
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Posted 7/25/2005 6:01 PM
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There is no question that first responders will be targets.  It's only a matter of time.  What better way to make the public feel insecure.
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Posted 8/5/2005 6:01 PM
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For the past three years the number of strange incidents in and around EMS facilities has grown drasticly.  The number of strange people asking rather specific questions about EMS methods and capabilities is increasing each year. A typical case would be a group of men asking about joining the EMS unit and then asking specific questions about the Standard Operating Procedures about the squad. Then after gaining just such information they then say well we will have to think about it and then they leave without even asking for the basic membership form.

Just looking at this information I would have to say not only are they going to be targeted but they will most likely be used to carry out further attacks. Maybe an ambulance rigged as a truck bomb and then driven to the nearest Trama center and detonated, not just killing innocent people but takin out a vital part of the EMS infrastructure at the same time.  How many people will be calling Ambulances after the first ones start  blowing up.

 

" chance favors the prepared mind "
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